Every morning, since I was 15, I have worn a tallit for prayer in my home. During my army service, I was forced to swallow many negative comments by other soldiers who prayed in the army synagogues, some of which did not even have a women’s gallery, because female soldiers never set foot in them. After leaving the army, I began to visit the Kotel every Rosh Hodesh. The atmosphere at the Kotel, the feeling that all those women praying around me were also turning to God and pouring out their hearts to Him, inspires me with the joy of Jewish fraternity. Here is one place in which, shoulder to shoulder, all the hearts are calling to God.
Prayer at the Kotel is so different from private prayer at home, or from communal prayer at the synagogue. It is a mixed creation: I am in a communal place, with many worshippers, but not even one voice can be heard. Just soft murmurings, choked crying, mute requests.
“God stands in the congregation of God” (Psalms 82) but it appears that God is not alone in this holy place. There is also hatred and contempt, arrogance and argument. At least that is what I experienced when I prayed in the women’s section wearing my tallit.
The response of the “righteous women of the Kotel” to my donning a tallit never delayed in coming: every Rosh Hodesh I could expect a different type of “blessing.” Curses in Hebrew and Yiddish, venomous treatment toward me and my tallit, and speculation regarding my gender and religion: “A man in the women’s section!” “He’s not even Jewish!” “Perhaps she’s dressed up for Purim?”
I tried not to hear. I tried to concentrate on my prayers and to pray to God “who blesses His people Israel with love” that He should bless His people with the love of man for His fellow man. How can I pray for the building of the Temple when the people are not ready for it? When someone performing a biblical mitzvah is derided and ridiculed?
One Rosh Hodesh, when I had finished my prayers and was making my way out from the prayer area, I suddenly saw a group of tallit-wearing women standing and praying
together. It was my first meeting with the Women of the Wall — Conservative, Reform and Orthodox women who have been meeting to pray together every Rosh Hodesh over the past 21 years. Some wear a tallit, tefillin or a yarmulke, some do not: each according to her religious outlook. I immediately felt that my place was with them.
Each month we suffered verbal violence. The police looked on with amusement. The high court had decided some years ago that prevention of violence is justifiable grounds for the police acting to avoid an “offense to public sensitivity.”
We were forbidden to continue praying with ritual objects, forbidden to read from the Torah in the women’s section. We were allocated another space, away from the main Kotel plaza, a place for second-class citizens, in which we could pray without, God forbid, forcing the offended public to be exposed to the brutal sight of women performing the mitzvahs of tzitzit and reading the Torah.
The morning of Rosh Hodesh Kislev, November 18, was a cold Jerusalem morning. We stood, 42 Women of the Wall, and prayed in the women’s section. Our tallitot were hidden under our coats; the sefer Torah was in its regular bag. There was no booing, no pushing, no shouting.
We were surprised that our service passed off without any disturbance, and we thought that, perhaps, they had already become accustomed to our presence and that we could even read from the Torah, opposite the stones of the Kotel. Then, just moments after we had removed the sefer Torah from its bag, two men entered the women’s section and began abusing us.
All we wanted was to conclude our prayers in peace, so we decided to forgo the Torah reading there and go, as on every other Rosh Hodesh, to read the Torah at the alternative site. As we were exiting with me carrying the Torah, a policeman met us and began forcefully pushing me toward the nearby police station. Our pleas and explanations that we were on our way to the alternative site were of no use. I was transferred for questioning to the station at David’s Citadel. All I had on me was my tallit, my siddur and a sefer Torah.
In my interrogation, I was asked why I was praying with a tallit when I knew that this was against the Law of the Holy Places. I am an Israel Defense Forces officer, a law-abiding citizen, a volunteer for the Civil Guard — I have never incurred even a parking fine — and the idea of having broken the law was most trying. Nevertheless, I cannot allow my basic right to freedom of religious worship to be trampled because of a court ruling given years ago.
It is most doubtful that this ruling would be accepted today. In the wake of the Conservative and Reform movements, during the past 10 years, people in the Orthodox world have come to understand that the woman’s place is no longer restricted to the kitchen. Feminist Orthodox women are demanding to take an active part in Jewish life. Egalitarian Orthodox synagogues, in which women don tallitot and lead services, are popping up like mushrooms after rain. The “public sensitivity” has changed.
The Kotel belongs to all the people of Israel. The Kotel is not a Haredi synagogue, and the Women of the Wall will not allow it to become such.
I was banned from visiting the Kotel for two weeks, and a criminal file has been opened against me. I hope that the file will be closed, especially so that my medical studies will not be jeopardized. Perhaps, with God’s help, this regretful event will awaken wide public objection, enough for the high court to re-evaluate its decision and annul it.
Jerusalem is the city of holiness and justice for all humankind. From Zion, the voice calling for equality should be heard, for boundless love, for better understanding between people. Jerusalem has already been destroyed, due to unfounded hatred. Let us hope it will not happen again.
Nofrat Frenkel is a fifth-year medical student in Israel and an active member of the Masorti kehilla in Kfar Saba. This was translated from the Hebrew.
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Thank you for sticking to your principals. I am sure that the verdict of history will be on your side even if the corruption of chareidi influence works against you in the short term.
Nofrat, when you leave behind your ego and feminist influenced ideas of 'victimhood' that will be the day when you make a much closer connection to the Almighty. It will also open a deeper understanding into the inner and outer manifestations of worship.
We've seen the continued "horthoxization" by the parasitic ultra orthdox and even some of their not so nut fringes. It's one thing to enforce sexual segregation and another to tell people how to dress.
I suggest all maisntream Jews from the Diaspora who go to the Kotel, men and women, bring a rubber chicken to do a mock Kapporot in protest of these haredi thugs and their enforcers in the government. Why don't they move to Kiryas Joel or Monsey since ethey don't recognize the state anyway.
I am simply confused. I am not an orthodox Jew nor do I agree with all of their proncipals. However, men and woman are not the same . Period. We have a different physical make-up and a different spiritual make-up. G-d gave men certain commandments and certain commandments that are for a woman. (I dont hear of men insisting that they have equal rights in lighting Shabbat candles or the laws of niddah). We were created differently and therefore have different needs to make us spiritually complete. Just because in the past 75 years there have been those that are working at blurring those lines in the name of equality, does not give anyone a right to throw it in theface of those praying at the kotel. The kotel has a mechitza. Why? I would like to daven with my husband as I do in my temple at home? Because the kotel has been and always will be a place that conforms to the highest standards. Fact is that the ultra orthodox take great offense to those trying to modernize the Torah , in whatever fashion (including trying to equalize men and women.) My family has found a temple that we feel is the correct meddium. One that does make certain allowances but ones that we feel make sense. I would love to understand what Miss Frenkel's great insecurities are that she feels the need to wear a tallis so 'she can be like a man". Grow up!
Arrested for praying??!! Unbelievable!
My thoughts are with you. Stay strong.
If the civil court has ruled that there is a specific site for Conservative and Reform services at Robinson's Arch overlooking the Wall,the women should have used that location. Nonetheless it should not involve the police, who are well known to compound problems. A polite word and an offer of helping to carry the Scroll to Robinson's Arch would have shown a lot more Daas Torah.
Is your struggle for the sake of heaven or is it for personal reasons?
Hizki ve-imtzi!
This incident at the Kotel is only the latest offense I have heard of at that place, a Significant Place, an IMPORTANT PLACE.
Of all the beauty that is Israel, my sense of outrage at the treatment of non-black-hats at the Kotel has forever tempered my desire to return. If I ever do return, I will certainly not go to the Kotel while the Haredi and other extremists make the rules. How can I share my devotion, my love, my fervor of being Jewish when I cannot pray for my family WITH my wife and three daughters? I realize that by me NOT going, "they" win. But what a hollow victory. These parasites who do not serve in the Army and live to beg for alms will soon drive out everyone who provides for their upkeep.
Each day, our prayers contain tefillah for the Temple to be rebuilt. Optionally, my siddur has a paragraph that replaces that prayer. As of now, I can no longer pray for the rebuilding of the Temple for fear that those who have hijacked Israeli Judaism and locked it up in an 18th century prison will desecrate the Temple by their mere presence.
While my scholarship is impoverished, I seem to remember that God did not want us to have a King or to build Him a Temple. Perhaps we should have listened to Him.
May God hear my prayer. Michael FL, USA
As an orthodox woman who is happy to pray without tallit in a segragated shul, I fully understand and support Nofrat's right to pray at the kotel in the way she chooses. Her decision to wear tallit may be even more frum than my decision not to. Numbers 15:38-39 seems to be fairly clear that all of the children of Israel should put fringes on all four-cornered garments and at the end of the day, a tallit is a glorified scarf that's a public display of commitment to this mitzvah. Doesn't anyone else remember that wonderful footage of the kotel after the 6 day war when families with mothers in mini skirts went to visit the kotel together, before the mehitza was there? The kotel is NOT a synagogue and should be a place that it open to all Jews and non-Jews alike to worship in the way that's meaningful to them. Why is tolerance such a one-way street, where we have to be tolerant of the ultra-orthodox and they don't have to give us the same courtesy? Yashar koach Nofrat and the women of the wall! May justice and compassion prevail and Hashem grant you success in all your endeavours!
Kol HaKavod. You do us proud. Your deep sincerity and serious principled actions can serve as an example to women, indeed oppressed people, everywhere.
Thank you.
With Jewish friends like the Haredi we don't even need enemies like Hamas!
Every discipline has its ritual.In this current age we hear many voices proclaiming the right of the individual to ignore tradition for the sake of their own egotistical desires, 'If it feels good, do it.' This person is but one of many who have been taught to believe that their own personal desires are more important than any established tradition. This is a materialistic , a very selfish era and its hallmark is a complete disrespect for authority of any kind, religious or secular.
Battle them with all you are. They cannot fight the future.
Nofrat, I commend you. Pluralism is so desperately needed in Israel. Many people are turned away from Judaism because there is only one official way to be Jewish. If pluralism were embraced and tolerance was practiced, many more Jews would open themselves to the wisdom and beauty of Judaism. I wish Nofrat, the Women of the Wall, and the Reform and Masorti movements the best of luck.
This woman doesn't have children and probably won't. The Haredi women do.
We'll see which side history is on. Don't bet against people who breed like rabbits.
Nofrat, I am so sorry you've become victim to someones idea that they can control access to G-d. Yasher koach.
ELI- the question here is what she is trying to prove?? I am not asking for anyone to stop you in your own home - but why is there this driving need to establish men and women as complete equals in regards to every law? You took 2 sentences out of my paragraph. We al lhave different laws. Accept it! It doesnt make anyone better than the other. But we WERE created differently! FYI- the halacha is that if there is no woman in the home than the man should light the candles so I am sorry but you are acting in accordance with what the "religious police" would want of you
Paulette, Nofrat and women like her aren't "throwing anything in anyone's face." People are offended because they choose to be, and in my experience, the perpetually offended are also the perpetually intolerant. Up until 50 years ago, Black people couldn't drink from certain water fountains or sit in certain bus seats because many white people were offended. Being offended and outraged does not establish one's virtue. And you don't hear of men insisting they have equal rights to light Shabbat candles? I'm the single father of a ten year old boy. I think it's important that we celebrate Shabbat. I light the Shabbat candles, every Friday night. Should someone come and stop me? Should the religious police arrest me? Should I care that I might offend someone? Open your eyes, Paulette.
Is she a he? The photo does not look like a woman. Perhaps the people who protested don't like gays or perhaps she has an agenda other than donning talit.
The Ultra Orthodox Zealots are turning off secular Jews in America, with bad behavior toward Jewish women.
Two thousand years ago, the Zealots were crushed by Rome. It looks like the Zealots want to be crazy extremists again.
Only 6% of American Jewery are Orthodox. Zealots' behavior is unacceptable. Are the crazies our Jewish Taliban? These crazies are not building the Israel of Ben Gurion. These ultraorthodox are leftover fossils from the Medieval Dark Ages!
What can we do to help? Writing from Ann Arbor Michigan, USA. Let us know....
@Larry Cohen
Ms. Frenkel is in fact a lesbian. See her article about being a religious lesbian here: http://www.uscj.org/All_is_Created_for_H7983.html
Paulette, the question IS NOT what is Nofrat trying to prove because she is not trying to prove anything. Perhaps the question should be what are you and other intolerant people trying to prove by preventing others from worshiping in their own traditions?
Hey Ben, what does Nofrat's sexual preference have to do with anything??? Ignorance seems to know no limit.
I invite all those who question the kavanah of these women to actually come and talk with them. I think you will be surprised. One of the beautiful things about Women of the Wall is that it is comprised of Jewish women from different backgrounds, Orthodox, Conservative, Reconstructionist, Reform, who find common ground and come together in prayer on Rosh Hodesh.
Kol HaKavod to these women for sticking to their principles, in spite of the great adversity. I hope that my daughter will have the same conviction to fight for what she believes is right and to fight for her right to pray. What is left when Jews are forced to stop praying because another Jew doesn’t like how they’re doing it? If you don’t like the way a group prays, then you simply do not have to join them. Disagreement and Respect are not mutually exclusive.
Ben - thank you for pointing out that article. I read it and was quite moved by it.
Larry - as a straight women who puts on tallit every morning and tefilin every morning, except Shabbat and hagim, all I have to say to you is "huh? what's your point?" I find deep meaning in fulfilling these mitzvot and do not do it lightly.
Don't you all get it?!? It's not about whether she was trying to prove anything. No Jew, and NO HUMAN BEING should be ever be publicly embarrassed or harassed. Shaming another human being, according to Judaism, is akin to murder. It's clear that is halachically forbidden. The tallit wearing? That falls a lot further into the grey area than the chillul Hashem and lashon hara of her persecutors. Take your self-righteousness elsewhere.
To Dave Tue. Nov 24, 2009 "This woman doesn't have children and probably won't. The Haredi women do. We'll see which side history is on. Don't bet against people who breed like rabbits."
The Haredi don't breed. They interbreed. Breeding into a closed population is not good for the genes as we all know.
I support Nofrat Frenkel.
My heart is with you!
Please see my article below, and our call for davening Shacharit on Sunday January 10th at 10 AM in public squares, around the world, with our tallitot!
http://www.tikkun.org/tikkundaily/2009/11/24/arrested-for-wearing-a-prayer-shawl/
Abby
Dear Nofrat, I support you. I feel that the intolerance and extremism displayed by some of the charridim is becoming a danger to our society and we need more people like yourself who are willing to take a stand. I was very moved by your article "All is Created for His Glory". May you find your way to live a righteous and fulfilling life.
visit my website for a different non controversial look at the land of Israel. wwwlDianaBarshaw.com
My heart is with you!
Please see my article below, and our call for davening Shacharit on Sunday January 10th at 10 AM in public squares, around the world, with our tallitot!
http://www.tikkun.org/tikkundaily/2009/11/24/arrested-for-wearing-a-prayer-shawl/
Abby
Sad, all the way around.
Admittedly, I'm more sympathetic to the Orthodox take on the wearing of a tallis, but to be criminally prosecuted and barred from going there for two weeks? I've seen the harassment that takes place at Kotel of non-conformists from other movements, some of it deserved, but seriously, we should all have better things to worry about whilst we're there.
From the look of it why aren't you davening or whatever it is that you do in the men's section anyway.
The freedom of religious worship that you refer to does not exist. You can read the Israeli basic laws, it is not there. You cannot wear shoes on the dome of the rock because that is a site reserved for the Muslims and the orthodoxy of their religion prohibits it. We will not allow worship if it offends the other worshipers. This is something you seem to acknowledge and agree with. After all your argument is that you should have been allowed to pray because public sensibilities have changed not that they don't matter. Those sensibilities have not changed and it was not your place to determine if they had. A compromise had been made you had been given a place to pray. You acknowledge that you should have been praying there when you defend yourself to the police by saying that you were on your way there. The police were merely enforcing the already made agreement which you violated. Yes you violated the law, your previous acts of patriotism do not change that. This actually diminishes your patriotism as it shows that you only obey laws when you agree with them. A true patriot of a democratic country obeys all laws passed by the legitimate legislative body whether he/she agrees with them or not. I hope you learned your lesson.
The hallmark of Reform Judaism and the Homosexual 'rights' movements are complete and total disrespect for ALL traditional values. And among their accomplices are the Forward as evidenced by their removal of several anti-reform and anti-homosexual comments from this thread. As befits their bias, ALL the comments attacking orthodoxy and Traditional values remain online.
This is emblematic of the reason why, as a liberal American Jewish woman, I am not comfortable in the present-day state of Israel.
The reason Jews in America are a rapidly disappearing minority is because the left wing took control of Judiasm in America and disparaged Jewish law and made up their own interpretations. Liberal Jews in American decided that if the father, and not the mother, is Jewish that is sufficient. They countenance conversions that are a joke, and they support gay marriage.
There's a reason why, after the immigration of one million Soviet Jews to America in the 1980's, that there are less Jews in America today than there were thirty years ago and that is because liberal Jews destroyed Jewish ritual and laws. You not only find them sanctioning gay marriage and making a mockery of Jewish laws and traditions but you will also find that they are the most vociferous anti Israel voices in America. They are Jewish in name only and those who mock and disaparage Jewish law and traditions cannot call themselves Jews.
A lot of what I wanted to say to you, Nofrat, was already stated by Rachel Clayman and Paulette.
Your description of what it's like davening at the kotel is right on the mark. I recently described it as akin to having a direct phone number for Hashem.
Maybe you could tell me, since I'm confused, what you accomplish by wearing tallit? Does it make you closer to Hashem? As someone who has never understood why women want to take on men's mitzvahs (or be their complete equal in any other aspect of life in general), this has always puzzled me. I remember a year or so ago being at a hotel where there was a Cantor's convention. It totally made me laugh seeing all these women in little tiny yarmulkes. And sharing their tefillin with their partners.
The Jewish people are the only nation on earth whose population has not increased since WWII. And it isn't because of birthrate alone - it's because the liberal branches (particularly, in my mind, the Conservative) are losing members faster then they can keep them. Already, in NYC, 25% of the Jewish population classifies themselves as Orthodox. And their numbers are growing, while the others are shrinking.
Nofrat, come to the USA where you'll be appreciated and where Jews like you are needed.
SO let me figure this out. You are super duper ultra orthodox in that you are more observant than the next "regular" ultra orthodox woman by wearing a tallit- yet you don't adhere to the plainly orthodox doctrine that woman do not don garments of men i.e. tallit. I think you are either severely misguided or have an ulterior agenda.
Its seems to me that one should respect the customs of the place where one prays. If wearing of the Tallit is the accepted norm for women in a particular synagogue or temple that is fine. However I would not expect a women to wear a Tallit in an orthodox synagogue which forbids it. I would also suggest that a man would not be allowed to sit in the womens section in an orthodox synagogue and vice versa. The rules at the Kotel are quite explicit and they need to be respected.
So what if Hindus decided to set up a shrine to their gods in the middle of the Vatican? What if a Jew for Jesus comes to a Reform temple and puts up a cross and worships it? Should the Vatican or the temple be more pluralistic? What about the "basic right to freedom of worship" for the Hindus or missionaries?
Everyone recognizes that there should be limits to freedoms. You don't need to and should not upset other people, especially if you have your own place of worship. The Catholics built the Vatican and made claim to it before the Hindus, the Reform Jews built and made claim to their temples before the missionaries. Similarly, the Orthodox are at least most continuous with the people who built or made claim to the Kotel first. They get to decide the rules.
Their rules don't really hurt other people, whereas disobeying the rules distresses the Orthodox. The Orthodox also seem to be the majority of people who pray at the wall. Besides for being the decent and respectful thing to do, following the rules also causes the least distress for the greatest number of people there.
Judaism is full of mitzvot dedicated for a Jewish woman to fulfill the needs of her soul, that men do not do. Candles, modesty, prayer, kindess, raising spiritual children, and making the Jewish home a sacred holy place. When the Jewish woman masters all of these and then needs something to do, then put on a tallit. Fine. When I as a man, have done all of my obligations, then maybe I can ask my wife to start lighting the candles. But I am a long way away from that.
G-d did not make me a non-Jew. He did not make me a Cohen. Etc. That's just how it is. Judaism is about working with what you have and who you are, not about changing the rules, to be someone else who you are not.
Rabbi Rosenberg is 100% correct in his above post. The extreme liberals in our community seek to define proper religious observance in the way they see fit, and totally discard and disregard Jewish law, rituals, and traditions. Judiasm cannot survive if the extremists try to contort it into some warped version of what they want it to be. The left wing that are distorting what Judiasm is all about, demanding syngagogues perform gay marriages are also part of the same anti Israel crowd in our commmunity. No Norfrat, you are not welcome when you try and define our faith in a manner that does not exist just to satisfy your personal agenda.
I think a little compassion is in order for Norfrat. She did not choose to be who she is and it's clear to everyone that wearing a tallit is the least of Norfrat's problems. The type of life she could possibly live with her gender and sexuality is way different than that which Judaism prescribes. Judaism demands sex segregated prayer to ensure the purity of ones praying, I guess free from sexual distractions but how does someone who has these identity issues pray when she is surrounded by the very same sex which arouses. How does that then work, it seems like a big struggle. She can't live a normal life and be a normal person but she is and wants to be Jewish but what is she supposed to do kill herself because she doesn't fit in. Despite ruffling some feathers, she is part of the Jewish family, she is someone's daughter and doesn't harm anyone, so a little rachmones is in order.
Well, JMK, Brenda Silverstein, Akiva, TZ, Rabbi Rosenberg, Josh, Charnie, Rachel Clayman and George: I don't know whether to be more astonished by your intolerance and nastiness or by your inability to stick to the point. How you choose to worship is not my business, and which is the better way to be a Jew is not going to be resolved here. What is under discussion is whether Nofrat and other non-conforming worshipers have the same right as the orthodox to worship at the Kotel free from harrassment and even arrest. Rabbi Rosenberg points out that "The rules at the Kotel are quite explicit and need to be respected," yet as eli points out above, the Kotel is NOT a synagogue. So, who makes these rules? A synagogue, supported by its members' funds and sweat, has the right to expect conformity with its customs. But the Kotel is a public space, supported by the taxes of the entire nation. Yet there, as in other areas of Israeli public life, the extreme orthodox get to call the shots. This is the injustice of the matter, and this is what is increasingly tearing the civic fabric of internal Israeli life asunder and driving a wedge between Israel and the diaspora.
It seems the thrill of Orthodox-bashing has eclipsed the facts of the story at hand - which are, as far as I can tell from this article and others about the incident, that it was the police who took action against the Women of the Wall. Not the big, bad, stuck-in-the-dark-ages Orthodox. I've been to Israel quite a few times, and from what I can tell, the majority of the police force is not Orthodox. Whatever one says about attitudes in of communities as a whole, or the occasional offensively vocal minority within a given community - this situation sounds like a simple case of enforcing a law. Perhaps the officers were over-zealous and could just have easily have said "Oh, okay, you're going? Great, thanks, sorry to have held you up." Perhaps they thought they had reason to be as forceful as they were. Perhaps they're just kids who think it's weird to see a woman in a tallit. Whatever is determined about their handling of the situation, can we please leave the Orthodox-bashing out of this one? And maybe even substitute some actual intelligent debate about the law and the question of whether it could or should be changed.
I was not aware one could do whatever they want at a Holy Place whether or not it was financed by tax dollars. There are rules that need to be followed.
If she has adopted the male practice of wearing a Tallit, why is she not wearing a head cover while reading the Torah.
Eli, you're a typical Leftist fool, unable to clearly comprehend what does not fit into your 'world-view.' If you were able to comprehend you would read that what I wrote was, 'what you do in the privacy of your own home is your business'. What you do at a place of public worship,when you deliberately choose to flout its long-standing ritual practise., is quite another.
Judiasm is not a make it up as you go along or as you see fit religion. The left wing fringe decides that they don't like particular Jewish laws and traditions so they reinvent them to their liking. Sorry, but that's not permitted. If the religion is too confining and too restrictive for you no one is commanding that you remain a Jew. Convert. Leave.
Frankly, I am tired of the left wing fringe trying to force their views on everyone else. My husband and I will leave our congregation if our Rabbi ever performs a marriage ceremony for two women or two men and so will our friends. It's people like Norfrat that want to take our laws, traditions, and rituals and toss the Talmud and the Torah in the fire and reinterpret Judiasm. They want to force their perverted views on the majority of everyone else. Enough already!
For mainstream media(or as Bernard Goldberg has aptly termed them,Lamestream media) there is no anti-traditional values cause or agenda that does not deserve front-page treatment. Homosexual marriage? They love it! Abortion on demand? They love it! Illegal immigration? They love it! Affirmative action quota mandates? They love it! The longstanding Liberal-Left appeasing paternalism of anything qualifying as 'minority affairs'? They love it!
Well, let's take this issue out of the realm of sex and gay marriage and etc for the moment, issues which seem to push a good number of posters here right over the edge of both civility and reality. My son is an adopted child. Knowing that the Orthodox establish the rules of conversion in Israel and the definition of "who is a Jew," I was careful to provide him with both an Orthodox brit milah and an Orthodox mikveh conversion. But that's no longer enough. The ultra of the ultra Orthodox, ensconced in the Interior Ministry, have revently rescinded several Orthodox conversions. Some, in Israel, because the converts are apparently not living in a "frum" enough manner. Others, in America (the case that affects us), because the Orthodox rabbis who performed the conversions are not on the "approved" list. If my son were to decide to marry in Israel, only to be told by some paragon of "frumitude" in the Interior Minisry that his Orthodox conversion was not Orthodox enough and that he therefore was not a Jew (in spite of having lived as one all his life) and could therefore not marry as a Jew in Israel, it would mark the end to my life long connection to Israel. I, a lifelong Zionist, the son of another lifelong Zionist, would definitvely have to turn my back on Israel. This is not a far-fetched scenario. It is happening every day, and is the result of the extreme Orthodox having a stranglehold on Israeli public policy, even thought the overwhelming majority of Israel's Jewish popularion is not ultra-Orthodox. And to Rabbi Rosenberg, who once again pompously maintains that, at the Kotel, "There are rules that need to followed," I once again ask, "who gets to make those rules, and why?"
Eli, if you really don't understand "who gets to make those rules, and why?", then you are beyond hope of appeal to logic and common sense. Let's just say that those who get to make the rules are eminently more qualified than you or Frenkel. As to your adopted son, if he chooses to go through with a proper and recognized by the RELEVANT rabbinical authority, he will have no problems.
It's time to say "Gut Shabbos" to all of you, no matter what that means to you personally.
However, let's take the subject of Nofrat's sexuality out of this discussion - it's not relevant. That's her private life, between her and Hashem.
What is relevant is that the Kotel is not just a tourist attraction, such as the Statue of Liberty, that is funded in part by the government. The Kotel is, without question, the holiest place in the Jewish religion, lahavdil, our Vatican and Mecca.
I dont' doubt for a moment that any liberal Jew visiting either of those places would completely respect their rules, such as taking off their shoes upon entering a mosque. But they spit in the face of their own tradition.
'even thought the overwhelming majority of Israel's Jewish popularion is not ultra-Orthodox'
You're splitting hairs. The overwhelming majority of Israelis consider themselves Orthodox in affiliation. In particular, among young, married israelis the overwhelming majority in recent decades has been in what is called Modern Orthodox.
Eli . The Israeli Supreme Court acknowledged Orthodox ownership of the wall. The wall according to them is tantamount to an orthodox synagoge.
Oftenthe public action of the ultraorthodox offends me. Who can I talk to about having them arrested and exiled? I believe I can find talmudic reasons for their being arrested and deported to the West Bank to spend time with others who do not recognize the nation I was born and grew up in.
To Meir Mordechai. Appointing a King was perhaps optional, but building the Tabermacle and later a permanent Temple, was a positive command or Mitzvah. The Third Temple will exist in Messianic times when many of our present disputes will be resolved and humankind will be united in understanding what G-d wants from them. As Isaiah says of those awesome days, 'And My House will be called a House of Prayer for ALL peoples.'
Many early authorities permit women to wear a tallit, such as Isaac ibn Ghiyyat (b. 1038), Rashi (1040–1105), Rabbeinu Tam (ca 1100–1171), Zerachya ben Yitzhak Halevi of Lunel (ca. 1125–1186), Rambam (1135–1204), R. Eliezer ben Yoel Halevi (ca 1140–ca 1225), Rashba (1235–1310), Aharon Halevi of Barcelona (b. ca 1235?), R. Yisrael Yaaqob Alghazi (1680-1761), R. Yomtob ben Yisrael Alghazi (1726–1802)) A gradual movement towards prohibition, mainly initiated by the Medieval Ashkenazi Rabbi Meir of Rothenburg (the Maharam). Basically because a Tallit or prayer shawl was defined as a men's garment and there is a Torah prohibition against cross dressing. Today a shawl is basically a women's garment, perhaps men should be baned from waring a prayer shawl
To:Rabbi Dr. Bernhard Rosenberg
You state "The Israeli Supreme Court acknowledged Orthodox ownership of the wall. The wall according to them is tantamount to an orthodox synagoge."
This is flat out false. The Court upheld the legal right of the women to pray as they had wanted in the Exrat HaNashim. What they decided was to accept the claim of the police that this could disrupt the public order in such a way that the police may not be able to provide protection. It is on that basis that the hooligans got their way.
You also stated: "If she has adopted the male practice of wearing a Tallit, why is she not wearing a head cover while reading the Torah."
What does one thing have to do with the other. Covering the head is not a Mitzvah and not directly related to the Mitzvah of Tzizit. And even if they were connected-in your eyes is it all or nothing?
Finally, you state "The rules at the Kotel are quite explicit and they need to be respected."
The rules are actually quite arbitrary. The "modesty police" there are volunteers from The Kotel Heritage Foundation that decide who is dressed appropriately and who not. Mormon and Christian groups pray, in keeping with their own traditions, in the Kotel Plaza but non-Orthodox groups may not. So just where are these explicit rules printed or available?
Check your sources, this is what I have found. Regarding the head covering, do you know any man that reads the Torah without a head covering. The head covering is a symbol of respect.Is this women shomeret Mitzvot, including shabbat. Inorder to wear the Tallit which is technically a man's garment, she must accept all mitzvot that are positive commandments bound by time as well as the other mitzvot.
P.S. Feel free to read Wikipedia - Western Wall
To Rabbi Dr. Bernhard Rosenberg You say "this is what I have found." Where? NOT in the court transcript.
You ask that I check my sources. I have a copy of the Supreme Court decision in front of me (I believe you can download it from the Bagatz Web Site). I will again assert that you are flat out wrong. First a panel of 3 High Court judges upheld the rights of WOW. On an appeal to a larger court panel the logic of the judges was the same but the court accepted police testimony that they would have difficulty protecting the public order.
You ask "Do I know men who read Torah without a head covering? So in your view Jewish Feminism must copy ALL male normative practices? A head covering is not a Mitzvah. And many of the women I know to do wear a head cover are mocked by others for doing so. So it is a no win situation.
Why is a Tallit "technically a men's garment?" A Tallit is a 4 corner garment. Men are required to put Tzizit on it if they wish to wear it. Woman may do so. The Midrash tells us that King Saul's daughter wore Tefilin (they say nothing about a kippah for her). The tradition has it that Rashi's daughter's wore Tzizit. Rabbi Shlomo Riskin says his Bubbie wore a Tallit Katan.
Are you making the silly, absurd, unfounded claim that if a women decides to accept to observe one positive time bound Mitzvah from which she has traditionally been exempted-she must take on all of them? MY PS to you: Read more Halacha and less Wikipedia. Read more Jewish feminism and less blah-blah from the close minded misogynists.
Andrew. To begin with see my earlier statements. If a women wants to wear a Tallit in a synagogue or temple that considers it normative that is fine. My issue is that the Kotel is considered to be an Orthodox synagogue. You do not have to agree with me. Regarding the laws of women not being bound by time restraining positive commandmants I suggest you ask your Rabbi. I do not ask you to agree with anything I say, obviously you understand the law and customs differently.You do not have to use insulting statements and I do not wish to deliver a lecture on women and Halacha. I am not suggesting anything, halacha is .If you dismiss orthodox halacha that is up to you.
Under a compromise reached two decades ag0 with the supreme court mediation,it was agreed that women who wish to wear tallitot and kippot and read from the Torah would be allowed to do at Robinson"'s Arch, adjacent to the Kotel, and not directly in front of the Kotel so as not to offend Orthodox worshippers. See complete article Jerusalem Post Nov.8 on this issue.
The tassels have become symbol of social status. The public display is more for those who wear it than for G-D. Like the kind of car we drive, the house we live in, or the jewelry we wear, this all is a ostentatious display of ---pride!
Is it not written in Mal 4:....."But for you who revere My name, the sun of righteousness will rise with healing in his wings.
The morning prayer of Abraham, ....touched he hem of G-D's garment. Humility------remember Ruth.
The banner of G-D that covers us every morning, the blue and white sky, the sun gives light to the moon. For the moon is like us, in it self, it has no light, only what the sun gives.
The blue and white that we are to put on is the light comes from G-D above, to the darkness of this pit, were there is only darkness do to our sins that cover us and make us blind. We look to the light given from above the symbol the sun, for G-D the Light of the All That Is.
To Rabbi Rosenberg, You told Andrew" I do not ask you to agree with anything I say, obviously you understand the law and customs differently."
True, but you impost your own "understanding" You decide what is a garment for a woman and what for a man (even though many Orthodox rabbis disagree with you, not to mention the non-Orthodox). YOU decide what the court said, even with the documents stating otherwise (using Wikipedia and a newspaper article as your sources).
There was never a compromise with the court. The court ordered that an area near Rabinson's Arch be built for the Women of the Wall. They NEVER accepted this as a compromise. It was forced upon them.
Finally, yes the Ezrat Nashim and Ezraet Gevarim may be seen as "Orthodox synagogues." But why should the WOW, and Masorti Jews, not ba able to pray in the upper Plaza where Christian (L'Havdil) groups may.
I repeat I have no problem with a women wearing a Tallit where it is the custom.I also never said women should not be able to pray in the upper plaza. What I said is that the Kotewl is considered an orthodox synagogue and the customs regarding such a synagogue should be followed. If one entered a conservative or reform synagogue or temple I would suggest one could not demand changes in their service.
For the record, I have always fought for the rights of Jewish women and would have been one of the first to defend a woman against being attacked by Zealots. My only concern in this discussion was explaining the issues. Yes, there are Tallesim and Yamukas made for woman . I was merely explaing the orthodox position. Regarding the Supreme court of Israel, I am no mavin and leave that to the lawyers.I understand why women are upset and want to fight for their rights at the Kotel. I encourage them to do so within the law. I as a person always respect the Shul I am in and follow those practices.If you wish to express your anger find the zealots at the Kotel who disrespect women and have no respect for anything but their own beliefs.
The Al-Quds Underground is an unconventional arts festival in the Old City of Jerusalem that was held on the first week of November with more than 150 performances including music, storytelling, theatre and dance. But when Gil Zohar, a reporter for The Jerusalem Post, showed up at the Damascus Gate to attend the show, to which he had received an invitation, he was asked by Jamal Gosch, the director of the a-Nuzha Hakawati Theater, where he lived. Zohar answered Jerusalem, in Arabic. When Jamal heard Gil's accent, he was told that Israelis were not welcome.
As Gil Zohar explained in his In Jerusalem article of Friday, November 6, the festival's Dutch artistic director Melijin Twaalfhoven told him, "Our team [of 12 Dutch activists and eight artists] had to promise that we would not allow peaceful Israelis to come."
The project was funded by the European Union through the Dutch charity Cordaid and the Alexandria-based Anna Lindh Euro-Mediterranean foundation for dialogue between cultures.
What dialogue between cultures is being promoted here? Perhaps the EU is more interested in dialogue between the Dutch and the Palestinians than in dialogue between Israelis and Palestinians.
Zohar explained that Al Quds Underground's "no Israeli" rule was part of a larger policy set by the Palestinian Boycott Divestment and Sanctions National Committee, the goal of which is to isolate Israel as South Africa was isolated in the days of apartheid.
A public arts festival in Jerusalem, funded by the European Union and respected foundations, which Israelis are banned from attending. And it is the Israelis who are accused of "apartheid."
The young, hip Dutch artist Twaalfhoven, no doubt specially flown in to direct this festival, is described as a visionary. He says, "I sometimes break through the boundaries between art and life. That is the core of my work."
I fail to see what boundary was being broken through here. It seems that, on the contrary, a barrier was being erected. And yet Twaalfhoven apparently has no problem with such blatant discrimination and divisiveness.
A project such as this should not be funded by the EU. Or by the Anna Lindh Euro-Mediterranean Foundation for dialogue between cultures. Or by Cordaid, a Dutch international development organization with over 1000 partner organizations in 36 countries. According to its website, its focus is on emergency aid, poverty eradication, health and well-being, and entrepreneurship.
What kind of health and well being was being promoted at the arts festival?
And here is a description of the goals of the Anna Lindh Foundation:
The Foundation leads regional initiatives in the Euromed space and supports local activities carried out by organizations based across civil society which advocate for a better understanding among people, religions and beliefs, and champion human rights and democracy."
Which human right is being championed here? The right to discriminate? The right to segregate? The right to forego dialogue? What kind of understanding is being created?
According to its website, Anna Lindh, a Swedish minister who was assassinated in 2003, was known for her work in the Euro Med area, especially in areas of dialogue and mutual understanding.
The foundation professes that its goal is to fight extremism and encourage civil dialogue. How ironic that a foundation that espouses dialogue should fund a project that prohibits it.
I propose that we bombard both websites with requests that it ban this kind of funding.
http://www.euromedalex.org/contact
http://www.cordaid.nl/English/About_Cordaid/Index.aspx?mId=10182
We should also write the European Union.
http://europa.eu
Just another example of the problems inherent in a country without separation of church and state.
Despite a gradual movement towards prohibition, mainly initiated by the Medieval Ashkenazi Rabbi Me’ir of Rothenburg (the MaHaRaM), and while historically, according to Rabbinic Halakhah, women have not been obligated to don a Tallit, as they are not bound to positive Miswot which are time-specific (Babylonian Talmud, tractate Qiddushin 29a), and the obligation of donning a Tallit only applies by day, many early authorities permit women to wear a Tallit, such as Rabbi Yishaq ibn Ghiyyat (b. 1038), RaShI (1040–1105), Rabbeinu Tam (ca 1100–1171), Zerahyah ben Yishaq HaLewi of Lunel (ca. 1125–1186), RaMBaM (1135–1204), R. Eli‘ezer ben Yo’el HaLewi (ca 1140–ca 1225), RaShBA (1235–1310), R. Aharon HaLewi of Barcelona (b. ca 1235?), R. Yisra’el Ya‘aqov Alghazi (1680-1761), R. Yomtov ben Yisra’el Alghazi (1726–1802)). According to the Poseq Rabbi Joseph Soloveitchik the issue depends on the intention with which such an act is undertaken, e.g. whether it is intended to bring a person closer to the Almighty, or for political or protest purposes. The Poseq Rabbi Mosheh Feinstein wrote that permission is granted to every woman who wishes to fulfil even those Miswot which the Torah did not obligate; and they indeed fulfil a Miswah and receive the reward for the fulfilment of the commandment - and according to the custom of the Tosafot they may also say the associated blessing - for Shofar, Lulav. And also Sisit are applicable for a woman who desires to wear a four cornered garment - it should be different than a man’s garment - and by putting on it Sisit, she fulfils this Miswah. (Iggerot Mosheh, Orah Hayyim 4:49, s.v. ibra d’ika
Rabbi Yisra’el Ya‘aqov Alghazi and Rabbi Yomtov ben Yisra’el Alghazi held that the observance of this mitzvah by women was not only permitted but actually commendable, since such diligence amongst the non-obligated would inspire these women's male relatives to be even more diligent in their own observance.
As I believe the majority are, I am an atheistic Jew. I think that praying at the Wall is meaningless. From my viewpoint, it was just a slaughterhouse.
Having said all that, it is shameful that anybody who wants to pray there peacefully is interfered with. As for offending the sensibilities of the very orthodox, many of the things that they do offends me but I do not stone or shout nasty things at them. As far as the involvement of the police is concerned, their commander should be disciplined. Somebody should tell them that they are not Cossacks.
I have lived in Israel since 1971. What has been so distressing to me over the years, is the lack of tolerance, bigotry, even violent behavior displayed by supposedly religious, God-fearing Jews toward other Jews who are not part of their particular sect or religious orientation. Unfortunately, the behavior and actions of these so-called "Torah true Jews" has made Judaism into something ugly and turned many Israelis against the Jewish religion generally. Would the ultra-Orthodox be allowed to behaved this way in Diaspora Jewish communities? Would they even dare to do so? Why are they allowed to do so here? This appears to be another strong reason why Israel needs a separation between church and state.
What a pity that this woman does not truly comprehend the mitzvot that women have in Judaism, and the mitzvot that men have. There are laws, better known as Halacha which overides the ego of women acting like men. I personally would not want the obligation of wearing a tallit, or the obligation of wearing tefillin as I do not have time to prove to the outside world that I am uncomfortable with my role as a woman in Judaism. The story of "Yentyl" whereby Barbara Streisand so much wanted to attend a yeshiva for men only somehow strikes a chord here. Perhaps Ms. Frenkel ought to look into the fabulous women's seminary or better yet college of higher learning known as Nishmat. That school does allow what women want regarding womens'roles in today's society, so give it a try, ask a lot of questions, you will not feel intimidated or discriminated against. Being a woman of Judaica, and a knowledgable one at that, I can truly speak from my heart, learn the right way to be cognizant of your observances in the world of Jewry.
Haham Qanai,
One small quibble: I don't see how it is a mitzvat `aseh shehazman grama. If I recall correctly, the conclusion in the Gemara is that night is also "zman tzitzit". Further, it's not even a misswah hiyyuvit, it's qiyumit - IF you wear a four-cornered garment, THEN it must have tzitziyot. So there is, it seems to me, no obligation to don a Tallit by day, only a strong minhag, and thus no real differentiation (other than cultural norms, "es passt nisht" as they say in Chinese) between men and women regarding the obligation of tzitzit.
To the rest of the olam, while there has long been rabbinic discouragement of women from wearing tefillin, the opposition to women wearing tallit/tzitzit has been much thinner.
Joan Lea:
>There was never a compromise with the court. The court ordered that >an area near Rabinson's Arch be built for the Women of the Wall. >They NEVER accepted this as a compromise. It was forced upon them.
I was given to understand that the Robinson's Arch solution was offered as a settlement to the Conservative, Reform and WotW groups. The Con/Ref groups accepted the settlement, while the WotW did not, and continues to pray on Friday mornings (without sefer Torah most of the time) in the women's section at the main Kotel plaza. It was not a court order, except, I think, the part about not leining in the main plaza.
andrew...'So in your view Jewish Feminism must copy ALL male normative practices?'
Andrew, I'm sure a smart fellow like yourself knows that the modern Feminist movement with Lesbian rights as one of its main foundations, has always stood in opposition to ALL male normative practises.
sidney...'As I believe the majority are, I am an atheistic Jew.'
Sidney, if you are referring to American jews, I don't know if they are atheists but they are not orthodox in affilation. Let me suggest to you that the intelligent and logical person can never be an 'atheist' on a subject so vast and mysterious. Hopefully, you will progress up the ladder of cognition to 'agnostic.' As for Israeli Jews, the vast majority are orthodox to one degree or another.
For Orthodoxy the final word in Halacha is the Shulchan Aruch.
See it for yourself
http://yfrog.com/5ztalit4womenj
Is this a discussion of "religious discrimination" or inndividual's discomfort in their own skin. Religious rules need not conform to current cultural trends or fashions which may or may not be temporary or transitory. Who says that God will not listen to this woman's prayers unless she dons man's apparel? Where is this written? And while we are on the subject of offense, what about the discomfort of those who are offended by her disrespect of tradition?
Rabbi Andrew Sacks: Just a few questions? "Oppressed people everywhere?" A joke, right? Jewish women are oppressed by Jewish religious tradition? Of what liberation theology are you a Rabbi? Liberation theology? Is this a website of a Jewish masquerade society? Speaking of discomfort, many of you pretending to be fervently Jewish make me very uncomfortable.
She shouldnt be there at all. Your so called holy site is actually the al Buraq Wall where Mohammed tied his steed on the night of his vision. If you want a temple, the stock exchange is on Wall street
T.Z. -- Jews for Jesus do not worship a cross. We worship HaShem, and Him alone. Other than that, your argument makes a certain amount of sense.
I think you are a brave and very impressive young woman. I am proud of you and wish you well in all things.
I am sorry for any abuse you have suffered at the hands of the Haredim and their facilitators. This is not the first time they have betrayed Jewish principles in the quest for power over others. However, Nofrat, I hope your take some comfort in knowing that so many fair-minded men and women all over the world either agree with you, or respect your right to your opinion.
I have never been to the Wall, or to Israel, but I can't help thinking that reading about these troubles has dimmed my desire to travel there. One thing I do wander about though, the people causing the trouble, Ultra conservative or not, aren't they also at the Wall to pray? How can they be busy watching others and fully focused on their own conversation with Ha Shem? I have noticed at the services I attend, that there are those who are praying, and those who are talking amongst themselves. one or the other, not both. I would image it's the same at the Wall, or any other location, you focus on others, or you focus on G-D. I don't understand how anyone could do both.
Ah yes, Mohammed's dream. Mohammed never set foot in Jerusalem. That is just another moslem myth which tries to link islam to Jerusalem. Since he never was there, let's say he dreamt he was there .What doesn't belong on the Temple Mount is Al-aqsa. And one day, it will no longer be there. That you can count on.
Kol hakavod, Nofrat, and hazak v'hazak. May our children live to see a world in which women and men may pray freely and fervently at the Kotel wearing tallit, kippah, and reading from the sefer Torah, without fear of harassment, abuse or other shameful behavior. We are with you.
The four sides of the garment...the north, the south the east and the west....were ever the day or night take me his garment keeps me safe.
For it is written...Psalm 23 He restores my soul. He guides me in paths of righteousness for His name's sake.
The altar we are to place our free-will offering . Isaiah 10...the Light of Israel will become a fire, their Holy One a flame...
For it is written...Psalm 111....He provided redemption for His people; He ordained His covenant forever holy and awesome is His name.
What you did was admirable and courageous. In an act reminiscent of Rosa Parks you have become a lynchpin, or at least part of a lynchpin, for social reform. Brava Nofrat!
It is important to teach a young person how to think right before he learns how to think...otherwise it's too late. For Haredi and Evangelicals this is sacred counsel! Like they say in the old country, the dogs bark the caravan passes! I love you Nofrat!God loves you
Let's not confuse the issues. There are all kinds of prayer services in Jerusalem. The Kotel area is an orthodox synagogue by consent of tghe overwhelming concensus of all Israelis. It is worthwhile for minority groups to be part of a struggle , it helps them galvanize and sise funds. This is not an attempt to prevent anyone from praying with a tallit, it is an attempt to preserve the nature of prayer at a specific place . Love and let live means that those who desire a non ortghodox service or an egalitarian service or any other variation should not do so in a way that upsets the truly held beliefs of the majority of worshippers at the Kotel. The Coservatives want this to be an issue of civil rights, like "seperate but equal". I beg to differ. We have so many fighting groups in Israel, on the one hand the ultras want segregated buses and the egalitarians want mixed prayer services and the Israeli secularists don't know how to deal with it. Maybe we need Mashiach now.
How sad and pathetic; the more I read some of these comments and the actions taken by the authorities, the more I wait for in inevitable... Only a matter of time before Judaism in Israel looks much like fanatical Muslim. Better start shopping for my burka before my trip.
Please keep the issue simple (because it really is simple). Women simply do not have a "chiyuv" to wear a tallit, kipah, daven with a minyan (they do not have any role in a minyan, why not fight for that too?) read from the Torah, etc. I commend her for her ballsy efforts, nevertheless, she is deliberately provoking an otherwise peaceful situation where people just want to pray in silent harmony with G-d, not have to witness a scene stirred up by random feminists trying to pick and choose where they prefer to be equal. THERE IS NO CHIYUV - DONE!
You don't have to look any further for an explanation of frenkel's action than to read the comments by those supporting her. The delusion and lack of comprehension as to the matter of respect for traditional ritual is glaring. Couple that with the inane idiocy as stated by Shifra in NYC and all is illuminated. These people of the Left care only about one thing: the immediate gratification of all their desires to the exclusion of anything else. Exactly like a small child, as anyone who has raised children will immediately recognize.
I would like to say that I am "shocked" by the arrest, however, when religious observance remains in the hands of a male majority, even that which is "mutar" (allowed) can become "assur" (forbidden) for women. As an orthodox woman, I would like to extend my sincerest condolences for the humiliation you have suffered and I would like to applaud your efforts to connect to God in your own way.
Reading these comments have made me very sad. I am sick and tired of the orthodox and ultra-orthodox claim to know what the motivates a person and what is in their hearts when said individual does something they do not approve of. The want us to respect them and their life style, but there seems to be no reciprocal efforts and treatment by the Ultras for everyone else. BTW I do not accept the kotel as an orthodox shul, so I'm not sure who the everybody who agrees that this is true are. I find going to the Kotel a very unmoving experience. I feel that even though I am dressed and act appropriately not wanted there. The women's section is small and over crowed, and the hardi women seem to have dibs on the wall itself. Meanwhile the men's section has plenty of space to spear. Kol hakovad to Nofrat, the Women of the Wall and others for trying to reclaim the Kotel for all of us and not just the Hardi.
how ironic that the haredim view men AND women of ALL walks of judaism as equal when it comes to soliciting donations for their yeshivot, but when it comes to prayer, suddenly they employ a stricter than strict social hierarchy. maybe we should stop directly (and indirectly) funding these organizations that promote this archaic mindset.
Rebecca, declining to fund organizations that restrict religious freedom is absolutely the social action Jews should take.
The Kosel is an Orthodox Synogogue; get over it. The prayer area at Robinson's arch is specifically designated for non-Orthodox davening. The Robinson's arch is not a second-class area at all.
I almost wish they would add a third, mixed gender area at the main Kosel plaza itself so that it could sit empty 90% of the time in tribute to those who claim that this is so necessary.
Yishar Coach. The truth was not given to the ultra orthodox. Everybody is entitled to practice their religious, spiritual or atheist belief and values as they find fit. A lot of the behaviors that you describe by those self appointed "real" Jews are non Jesieh, against the biblical law and norms (for example, shaming somebody in public). there is a reason why interpesronal sins are not forgiven on Yom Kipur. Carry on!!!
All this bickering is divisive, unpleasant, and intolerant, as is most religion. I agree with roni. Everyone is entitled to practice or not practice, wear or not wear, worship or not worship. The Jewish Taliban are as dangerous and offensive as any other thought police.
Gotta say, I simply don't get it.
Where's the mutual respect?
Is a woman who breast-feeds entitled to do so wherever she wants, and not respect the feelings of those around her? While almost everyone would agree that nursing a baby is a good thing, doing so in some places may not be, i.e. in a boys school.
Why should this be different? No one seems to be saying she can't wear a talit at home or in any synagogue other than Orthodox. They're just saying that she should respect the fact that the great majority of people at the Wall are Orthodox. Not just in tourist season, and more-or-less 24/7/365, the Orthodox come there to pray in peace. Why not let them be, and express your spiritual feelings elsewhere?
A theist...'The Jewish Taliban are as dangerous and offensive as any other thought police.'
When the Orthodox Jews take up guns and begin beheading and stoning to death those who come under their scrutiny, and when they begin to blow themselves up among the civilian population, perhaps then, you shmuck, you may be entitled to refer to them as Jewish 'Taliban.'
This is all very disturbing. Ever since I first heard of the Ultra Orthodox throwing rocks at individuals they deemed to be improperly dressed, I have been wondering what has happened to so many Jews.
The Ultra Orthodox make a big deal over Queen Esther, but she was married to a non-Jewish man. What would the Ultra Orthodox say about a woman named Esther if she did that today?
Ruth is highly regarded, but she was a non-Jew who only converted after her Jewish husband died. What would the Ultra Orthodox of today say if a Jewish man married a non-Jewish woman named Ruth who did not convert before the marriage?
From what I understand, the tallit is not a sacred item. There are different styles, colors, etc. It is not clear that anyone needs to wear one so it cannot be for men only.
What is most important is that it is not only extremely bad manners but also very unJewish to make a public scene unless it is a matter of life and death or some other type of crisis situation.
Jews have enough bad publicity already. We don't need the rest of the world thinking that there is not much difference between Ultra Orthodox Jews and Islamic fundamentalists (not to be confused with the Taliban).
Nadav, They already started doing exactly this. Are you aware of those who call themslves orthodox Jews who murder people whose only sin is being Arabs? How are they different from other murderers?
Stephanie, the majority of people in the Kotel are orthodox because they rudely and aggressively chased away everybody else.
roni, do you understand the difference between a few isolated individual Jews carrying out acts of violence and an organized army of tens of thousands of Taliban who control half of Afghanistan where they behead, murder, stone, whip, amputate limbs,and are fighting a very successful war against America and its allies? Or is that obvious lack of comprehension a defect commonly shared by those who support Frenkel? One of many comprehending defects.
There is some confusion in several posts. The Israeli civil court ruled that the Western Wall has the official status of an Orthodox synagogue and that Robinson's Arch overlooking the Wall is set aside for Conservative and Reform services where women may wear a tallis and read from the Sefer Torah. The women in this case knew full well they were acting in contempt of court and knew they might well have a problem. Nonetheless I believe it was totally wrong to involve the civil police who are known for their hostility in matters of religion. Security members should have explained and offered to help carry the Sefer Torah around to Robinson's Arch. I can't see any Orthodox synagogue anywhere in the world involving the police in such a situation. The Israeli Chief Rabbinate must come up with an alternative approach, in line with the principle that 'all her paths are paths of pleasantness and lead to peace....
If people are offended by a women praying at the Kotel with a Talit, it shows they are insecure with their own beliefs. It shows they are offended by life in the real world where there are people with different beliefs- they expect everyone to be the same as them. If anyone finds a women wearing a Talit at the Kotel offensive that means they also find Jews who are different from them offensive and this just divides the Jewish people. If people really believe in God they know that it is up to him to judge women wearing a Talit and there is no need for any religious police.
Critics and suppressors of Nofrat and her sisters and brothers should hang their heads in shame...perhaps say 7 times seventy confessions of being "stiff necked" on Yom Kippur.To equate self selected 'traditions'with true Torah and the laws of G-D or halachah is arrogant blasphemy-those views especially as set forth in the mean spirited manner used by the likes of Larry Cohen and others-demonstrate ignorance of the spirit and substance of the entire call and joy of the mitzvahs. Only an anti semite at heart would curse,stone or chastise a Jew in prayer...actions that only validate the uncertainty of their own faith.
Nofrat says 'Curses in Hebrew and Yiddish, venomous treatment toward me and my tallit,' The Torah teaches us that every Jew must show kindness to other Jews "The world stands on three things: Torah (Jewish learning), Avodah (service of God) and acts of Chesed (loving-kindness)" Ethics of the Fathers 1:2 .
Jews do not have to agree with Nofrat but those who claim to be observant should follow the Torah properly and show kindness to other Jews. Showing hatred to others Jews who are from a different background who have had different religious experiences and a different education/ upbringing is not following the teachings of the Torah.
This Story in the Forward, Dec 4, horrified me. "The ‘Crime’ of Praying with a Tallit, and a Plea for Tolerance"
Is this the Israel that I LOVE or one that imposes ultra Orthodox laws like those in Muslim Islamic states called Sharia LAW ? Shame on what I thought was a democratic state, turns out to be a My Way or A NO Way State ! Talked to a Rabbi today who was just as miffed as I AM. Would be interested in receiving other views on this troubling matter.
SY ( Shloimie ) Weiss, Forward Subscriber, syweiss2@gmail.com
To expect 'respect' as a response to a 'disrespectful' act in a religious setting sums up the disturbed mentality of those whose real religion is the secular Torah of abortion on demand, legalization of homosexual marriage and every other issue favored by the Liberal Left. Frenkel's act was one of deliberate calculation and designed to draw the response she knew it would.
I am strongly against any racial or religious discrimination in any form and I respect the right of anyone to practice his or her religion providing that practice does not conflict with the laws of the land. It does bother me, however, that any branch of government would segregate or recognize any particular religion or race over another. I am a strong advocate of the separation of church and state for all states and do not believe that government, at any level, should differentiate. I care not what that religious group is. We should all keep in mind that in order to maintain a true freedom of religion no one religion should be given favorable treatment or recognition. It is only in that way that all religion can be free and not discriminated against. To recognize or favor any one religion only tends to discriminate against the others. I don't feel confortable with Israel calling itself a "Jewish nation" nor did I like it when Bush called my country "a Christian nation".
My friends, we should teach that it is more important what G-D sees, than what mankind see. For G-D sees with His eyes and heart, and mankind see with just their eyes.
We must ask our selves, do we do it for the eyes of this world, or do we do for the eyes of G-D? Peace is found in the heart of G-D. If we do something for G-D is it ,good if peace does not come from it? What gift is this that we give G-D!
Rituals, and customs religious thoughts of man are not G-D thoughts for His are high and pure, your are not!
HOW DARE THEY?!!!!!!!!!!! I can't believe that something like that could actually happen. For all of you who have issues with women wearing Talitot, may I point out that, though we are not comanded to, neither are we forbidden? Nowhere does it say that a woman may not wear a Talit. I have been doing so ever since my Bat Mitzva, and I read Torah and I lead services and I'm very proud of this. I wouldn't do it if I were forbidden. For God's sake (and I mean that literally) in all those places with the mitzvot for men that aren't for women it says men must and women MAY. Do you people not understand the meaning of the word מותר? Really. I am religous. I keep shabbos and kosher and tzniut and all of that. But I have endured people mocking me and questioning my faith because I want to wear a Talit. No one has the right to do that. And once you have taken a mitzva on yourself you can nopt change your mind. That's down in the laws of vows. It's in the Torah. Hence, women who've made the choice to observe the mitzva of Talit are now obligated to and to force them not to is against the Holy Law. Do you people who sit around reafing Torah and Talmud all day take in nothing that you read? Do you realize that by being so hostile and intolorent you are breaking the very rules you read all day long? Yasher Kochech, Nofrat.
Where in the Torah does it say women must not wear a Talit?
The reason that people believe that women should not wear a Tallit is because it is seen by some people as a male garment but because it does not say in the Torah that ONLY men can wear a Tallit, a Tallit may not be seen as male garment. If a Tallit is viewed as male garment by G-d then it would be referred to in the Torah as something ONLY men can wear.
In his weekly commentary on the Sedra Vayeshev ( covenantandconversation@communications.chiefrabbi.org ), Chief Rabbi Lord Jonathan Sacks recalls a situation in the 1970's where he was among a group of Orthodox yeshivah and rabbinical seminary students gathered in Switzerland for a conference. When the men were gathered one morning for Shacharis in a room in the hotel, they were unexpectedly joined by a female Reform Rabbi in tallis and tephilin! Unsure of how to react, they asked the senior Rav, who told them to carry on as usual, lest they offend this well meaning woman. One can draw one's own conclusions.
Nofrat Frenkel is a committed Masorti Jew, and as a champion for Women of the Wall, she will lead us all to a more tolerant Israel. She is also a proud lesbian, and although the Masorti movement takes pride in this stand at the Kotel, it would deny her a place at the Schechter Rabbiincal School in Jerusalem because of her sexuality.
what is truly sad - is that these women do not realize women are equal to men, just in a different and unique way. By demanding the right to copy everything a man does, you actually delegitimize women and suggest they posses an inferior status. A man cannot do what a women can do - give birth...No Man Can!!! So why should we want to do what they do. God created us equal but different, stop trying to make us the same - WE ARENT!!! Orthodoxy is far from perfect because human beings are scarcely ever flawless, but we respect and value holy ancient traditions and show them the reverence they are due. You can trot out your j-streets and brandish all your threats of tattling to the american public about the archaic israeli orthodoxy.......but in the end, your movements are dying, not growing. You do not marry Jews, you do not have children and the few that procreate well those children intermarry and are lost to our people forever. so good luck with your crusade, but your Hellenistic ideals will crumble and fail, because they are empty and meaningless, serving only your selfish needs and desires. As well, Judaism has existed or rather, thrived and flourished for two thousand years because of Orthodoxy, which guards, protects and insures its survival...and G-d willing it will continue to do so forever. When all the fake Hellenist Jews fade into the annals of time - orthodox Jewry will remain, ensuring our people's survival.
Ms. Frenkel is a sincere young person, who has the strength and energy to act in ways that are confrontational and challenging to the status quo. She has been brought up by loving, supportive parents in a largely tolerant community and she is acting out of love for G-d and love of Judaism. It is disappointing that other so-called religious people should behave so coarsely as to hurl insults at her at a place of worship.
At some point in her life however, I hope that she will be able to look back with compassion at those who have been so rude and hurtful towards her, realizing that they are acting out of ignorance and fear. She is not their victim. I also pray that through her youthful enthusiasm she has sparked an exchange of ideas which will bring greater understanding.
First, it is unfortunate that all Jews, even we who are American Jew living in a country that promotes freedom of religion endure ongoing conflict between the four primary factions of American Jewry. On one hand, it is wonderful that from liberal to orthodox, we are all so committed to the survival of our religion, culture, and yes, civilization. On the other hand, it is a shonda that we often have more tolerance for non-Jews than for our own who may observe differently. The more liberal we are, the more tolerant of others we tend to be, and the more angered we get by the intolerance of others, particularly when we are those who are criticized or not accepted by those who are Orthodox. We all need to come to terms with a few givens that will never change. First, within any faction of Judaism, there are good, honest, virtuous, honorable people, and there are those who are selfish, self righteous, dishonest, and an embarrasment to Judaism. Wearing a Mogen David or a kippot does not distinguish one from the other. Secondly, the level of observance one chooses is not contingent upon the faction of Judaism we choose. There are fromm Reform, Conservative, and Reconstructionist. Jews. Third, the Ultra Orthodox believe that traditional Judiasm is the only way to be Jewish. With credit to our most observant, they have preserved Jewish traditions and allow us all access to a historic culture and way of life. Fourth, the Ultra Orthodox will never change. These are some very predictable and ongoing givens that will not change in America and in Israel. What can change is the power given to one faction over another. In America no faction has power or authority over another. In Israel, this is different as religion is political. It is difficult for Americans to understand this, but this fight is not in our hands. Furthermore, any effort we can make via financial boycotts or political attempts will ultimately hurt all IsraelI citizens, not just the Ultra Orthodox. It is really the Israelis who need to join a Jewish movement of their choice to gain political power, join forces and form strong coalitions to change the balance of power in theit country and effect change. Many Israelis are currently unaffiliated, which gives even more power to the Ultra Orthodox. I commend Ms. Frenkel and the Women of the Wall for practicing Judaism in a way that feels right for them. I even applaud their efforts to make public their feelings about religious injustice imposed by those in power. Furthermore, I am so sorry that you had to endure such humiliation as to be treated as a criminal. I hope your efforts will encourage Israelis to join forces to gain power and make changes that allow tolerance for all.
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My middle name is translated from the Hawaiian meaning, "the voice of heaven". So, does this mean Ha Shem has a mouth? Or does he just allow for the fact of our human image and boundries? Recall that when Ha shem spoke the various forms into existence there were no forms but his spirit hovered over the deepest darkest of voids.
So, what then is really of significance to Ha Shem? Those things with form or the words uttered across the deepest and darkest of voids seeking the oomfort of his presence. And, these are the things... the beginnings of Mispatim.